Game lag while downloading torrents, even with QoS

Discussion in 'Tomato Firmware' started by Xaximus, Aug 14, 2009.

  1. Xaximus

    Xaximus Addicted to LI Member

    I'm running Tomato 1.25, and have never been able to solve the problem of game lag while downloading torrents, even with QoS configured to give game ports the highest priority and torrent ports the lowest.

    Typically, I'd experience latency of 100-200ms in World of Warcraft, for example, but with torrents running, that would increase to 3000-6000ms. Recently, I started downloading torrents via a separate computer on my home network, and that has helped significantly, but I'm still seeing latency of 300-700ms.

    Any ideas or suggestions?
  2. szfong

    szfong Network Guru Member

    We can't read your minds, can we. Which torrent program are you using? Is it Java-based (cpu hungry)? How many torrent initiated? You just can't open up massive # of connections and expect everything to work. Learn to restrict bandwidth usage based on the speed of your connection using the controls on the torrent program if all else fails. Use the scheduler and do d/l when your not playing games. Incoming QoS is often done by dropping, so use the torrent program to control incoming, might as well do it for outgoing also.
  3. Xaximus

    Xaximus Addicted to LI Member

    I suppose you can't read minds, no, and I suppose there's no need to be a douche, either.

    I'm using uTorrent; very conservative CPU usage. I'm testing with 1 active torrent. The speed of the downloads/uploads doesn't seem to be a factor; even if speeds are low, latency takes a hit. I could use the scheduler as a last-ditch option, I just figured this would be something the router/Tomato would be able to help with.
  4. szfong

    szfong Network Guru Member

    The way you frame your question in generalities, no one is ever going to reply to any of your questions in a meaningful manner.

    Trying to suck up the ocean with a straw + trying to play a game isn't going to happen on a budget Internet plan (which you don't mention). Knowing the # of torrents your trying to d/l is not helpful. D/l a dozen torrent with a few seeders/leechers vs d/l a single popular torrent with thousands of seeders/leechers are two entirely different scenarios.
  5. Toastman

    Toastman Super Moderator Staff Member Member

    Xaximus, Your QOS is obviously not configured correctly, or perhaps not at all. You are talking in terms of several seconds lag, so it appears your incoming bandwidth is totally saturated.

    Look here:

    This thread may help, and the more general thread below will help you to understand QOS and how to use it.
  6. Xaximus

    Xaximus Addicted to LI Member

    Thanks for the link to the thread; I will implement the suggestions and see what happens.

    I should mention that I don't believe the problem here is bandwidth saturation. I had set "lowest" priority outgoing bandwidth to 50% initially, and so there should be plenty of bandwidth left over for gaming. It also seems to happen even if my test torrent is finished downloading and is seeding. I have upload traffic limited to about 80% of my outbound limit in uTorrent, but even then I have lag. I've configured Tomato's "lowest" priority to 1-20%, so we'll see what happens.
  7. Xaximus

    Xaximus Addicted to LI Member

    Even now, I'm getting 2-3 times my normal latency, but I only have 1 torrent with 0 K/s download and 8-10 K/s upload with 6 active seeds.
  8. commandonut

    commandonut LI Guru Member

    qos unable to resolve about the latency even you run your utorrent with none download status utorrent are alway send and receive packet via internet and it make a lot of number of connection activity ,

    as Mr.Toastman said , so i can say it is specification of dsl technology?
    well Mr.Toastman did you find tomato firmware dualwan in english gui yet?
    i'm seeking for version above 1.23.0286
  9. Toastman

    Toastman Super Moderator Staff Member Member

    commandonut, no - unfortunately we have not received any response from the chinese author of DualWan tomato and he has not made any source code available. Perhaps the purpose of GPL has not been understood well in China.

    Xaximus - the fact that you have set your outgoing lowest priority to 50% shows that you did not understand the point of the QOS thread. Setting 50% outgoing P2P will always result in saturated downlink if you have any decent download servers, and especially if you begin seeding yourself. I always suggest you start with 1% rate and 10 % limit. You must also limit your seeds to a quite small amount in uTorrent. If you are on ADSL you cannot hope to upload much, best not to even try.

    You say "even now" - so what did you change? Perhaps it would help if you might also post your QOS setup details here for comment.

    I suggest you do two things - (a) read the thread again from beginning to end (b) Set up EXACTLY the example QOS and see if that solves your problem. Since it works for several hundred people just fine, I imagine it might do the same for you.

    I receive dozens of PM's and mails here and 99% of the time, the reason people's QOS does not work is that they have not followed the instructions. I have just checked - the main router here tonight has 11 people using P2P and the latency is averaging around 42 mS. You should be able to do better, assuming all else is working fine.
  10. pieddu

    pieddu Addicted to LI Member

    try decreasing number of connection for torrent in torrent settings. Every connection estabilished "eat" band....

    Control with
    netstat -lutanp
    for linux
    netstat -an
    on win
  11. Xaximus

    Xaximus Addicted to LI Member

    I said I had it set to 50% initially, but then set it down to 20% as you suggested in the QoS thread. I didn't notice any results, but I'll try dropping it further down to 10%.

    pieddu - My total connections number was at 250; I dropped it to 150 without result, but I'll also try dropping that down further to see if it helps.
  12. commandonut

    commandonut LI Guru Member

    too bad he ignore GPL , is he member on this forum ? i saw his firmware and function similar Tomato RAF.

    hope he will share some source code.
  13. Toastman

    Toastman Super Moderator Staff Member Member

    It is very difficult to communicate with him. Unfortunately, he seems very willing to take other people's code and use it, but not willing to share his own additions with anyone. Several members of his own forum complained, but the majority think that it is fine to withhold details so that others cannot "steal" the ideas. This does seem to be a very common attitude in Asia - take everything but give nothing back. Perhaps that will change.
  14. joeyford1

    joeyford1 LI Guru Member

    Interesting the OP is having issues with uTorrent. I just downloaded the newest version and just opened it (no torrents or anything) and its shows on my router as it opened a huge number of connections and was downloading full speed.

    I couldnt figure out why everything was so laggy, I closed it and bam back to normal.

    Would be great if someone who could test it in a sandbox or something to see exactly what it is attempting to do.
  15. Toastman

    Toastman Super Moderator Staff Member Member

    The first thing to do with uTorrent is to turn off DHT. That uses a lot of bandwidth as you have found, but I personally never see any downloads as a result.

    Then the rest is down to the QOS to cut down to size. If you are on ADSL then your upload bandwidth is very small, and one cannot hope to upload (seed) anything significant to gain "points". The best thing to do is to conserve that bandwidth for other, more useful, purposes. Limit seeding to something very small in uTorrent. (Mine is set to 20kbps, and I can still fill my incoming bandwidth without uploading anything, if I wish).
  16. joeyford1

    joeyford1 LI Guru Member

    Thanks! Didn't realize it was DHT. I was very worried because like I said, it was a fresh install of it (on a fresh Vista install too) and instantly took all the bandwidth with no torrents even added to it.

    I hate torrents. To me it just seems like such a waste of bandwidth, but the the latest update to a game I play will only be available through a torrent download (Entropia Universe).
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