Should I use QoS

Discussion in 'Tomato Firmware' started by xtacydima, Feb 6, 2010.

  1. xtacydima

    xtacydima LI Guru Member

    Not sure if my needs deem the need for setting up QoS. I recently installed Tomato on my new ASUS RT-16N and I have the following needs.

    1. Three people are always surfing the web, this is my biggest priority, I want fast load times on our web browsing.

    2. I run a Synology FTP server, and I always have a download per day from me to various friends, some in different states.

    3. I do occasional Movies/Music torrent'ing and sometimes leave PC on for a day or two straight running it.

    4. I will on occasion along with my wife log in to our IP Cam to check on the kid (via 802.11n).

    5. I recently bought the ASUS O!play to stream movies to my TV wirelessly (via 802.11n)

    6. On rare occasion I will play Wii games with friends online, otherwise no FPS games, but some strategy like Starcraft...ect...

    7. My printer runs off a JetDirect card through the router.

    My connection is 30down and 5up (I have an upgraded package) so my speeds are VERY nice generally speaking from my ISP (cablevision here in NY).

    Would the default router with no QoS meet my needs on a satisfactory level, or would anyone recommend QoS tweaking for any noticeable optimization?

    If so, based on what I mentioned, what settings would you recommend, I never used QoS before on Tomato.
  2. Azuse

    Azuse LI Guru Member

    1. Depends on 2
    2. Assign it to a low priority class via mac
    3. Sadly torrents are impossible to lock down unless you know the ports the client will be using. There's a best yo can get guide in the main qos thread but the only way to stop them choking the wan is bandwidth limiting by mac address which isn't available in the n16 tomato build, yet (fingers crossed).
    4. via n? As in the camera is wifi or you're connection via wifi rather than the wan?
    5. As above, local wifi needs no qos
    6. Prioritise udp traffic from the wii mac, pc games depends on the ports.
    7. Again local, no qos.
  3. xtacydima

    xtacydima LI Guru Member

    Azuse, thanks much for the reply.
    I actually missed the part where whatever is local has no need for QoS rules... dohh

    To answer the other points, yes I am specifying torrents to use a specific port in my utorrent app, no upnp here

    Now, the IP Cam will be local but external as well, using it as sort of a nanny cam while at work - although is going via http or https depending on my preference with a specified port as well, so I supposed I should somehow classify this???

    With regards to ftp, I suspected the answer you would give, however, games seem tricky.

    The tomato naming convention is not something I am used to for Qos, I have been using DD-WRT for years and their QoS is not nearly as sophisticated (also doesn't work well).

    If I may ask you, can you use the Tomato GUI from the stickies, and put together how you think I should set my QoS options to give me some starting ground, and post a screenshot of it. I saw so much on here with defininf WWW <512 & >512 as well as DNS and it was a bit confusing.

    My services I guess for QoS would be as follows.
    WWW - highest
    DNS - highest
    IP Cam - high when in use (would actually prefer higher than WWW)
    FTP - low
    utorrent - lowest or bulk or whatever you call it

    Of my 30mbps promised by my ISP I get on avg 22-25 and about 4 to 4.5 out of the promised 5mbps.
  4. Toastman

    Toastman Super Moderator Staff Member Member

    Try reading through the thread below, you should be able to mod one of the examples easily.
  5. xtacydima

    xtacydima LI Guru Member

    Toastman, my original question still remains though. Given my setup, my needs, my available speed, should I even bother with QoS... will I notice a drastic improvement?

    BTW, I looked at all of those examples, and yes I can copy and mimic them, but I was hoping for a better understanding of what each means, for example, is "Class A" lower or higher than "Lowest"? Any why all of the naming conventions with Classes, why not just call them 1-10 with 1 being he highest?
  6. Toastman

    Toastman Super Moderator Staff Member Member

    I'll try to answer your questions, but actually if you just read through the thread below they are already there.

    If you are a standalone user you don't usually need QOS. When someone else, or some other application in one of these add-on media boxes comes online, should it take priority over the web surfing, over what YOU are doing, or should it let them go first?

    When your friends upload to you via FTP do you want other applications to slow down or would you like to give all available bandwidth to your friends?

    When you or someone else is/are running torrents, is it in order for them to take all of your bandwidth and leave all your other applications stuttering on occasions?

    The answer is usually no. - so QOS will therefore probably help you in your current position. Usually the absolute need for QOS reduces as you obtain higher bandwidths, and yours is actually pretty high. So - you need to ask yourself, do any of these things happen? Will QOS stop it happening? The only way you will know for sure how much of an improvement, is to try it.

    Tomato QOS has TEN classes. Highest is actually highest, and E is actually the lowest. I personally hate this system, because most people misunderstand it and end up not using A to E. That deprives them of a lot of useful information and performance.

    The need for names of classes is basically to make it easier to work with the classification and interpretation of the graphs. It is extremely hard to relate "1" to "10" with anything you see, without constant reference to notes.

    You will only gain a better understanding of what things do by reading, and experimentation. Nobody can do this job for you. The base setup in the thread will help you to begin, and you should be able to see how to add any extra rules for your other stuff such as the cameras, or change the priority of your FTP for instance.

    Good luck!
  7. xtacydima

    xtacydima LI Guru Member

    Toastman, that actually defined things more simply and clearly.

    How would I go about the situation where, say I want one device to take the highest priority, but only when accessed. For example, when I access my IP Webcam remotely, I would want it to have the most available bandwidth, however, when I disconnect, I would want the Internet browsing to have the highest.

    If I set them both to highest it would simply be shared on the same level. On the other hand, given my bandwidth from my ISP, should I even bother?

    I will try to come up with some rules and post a screenshot here of them. Would you be willing to give me feedback on them? I understand from what you said the best way to know is to simply experiment, but I would want to make sure there are no obvious mistakes that are a definite no-no in my draft.
  8. Toastman

    Toastman Super Moderator Staff Member Member

    Your question perplexes me somewhat. You want something to take priority, but when it isn't on then change something else to that priority? I think you have misunderstood the whole concept of priority classes.

    If the webcam has highest priority, and is accessed, then it takes that priority over all other traffic. If it is not accessed, then that class does nothing. The priority now passes to the next class in use down the list.

    Going on your post above you need something like this:
    DNS - highest
    IP Cam - high
    WWW medium
    FTP - low

    All traffic not addressed by the above - Set your *default* class to lowest or E or whatever

    Basically, you can use the QOS sample in the post and just add a rule for your webcam. Replace all named classes with "Highest" down to "E" for normal Tomato compiles. Delete any rules you don't need if you must, or just leave them alone - which will be OK for most people.
  9. Dashiell

    Dashiell Network Guru Member

    What I have done with A-E I think works quite well... I was on a connection that normally provided 2mb/15mb. A few months ago I upgraded to 5mb/30mb. I've made all the classes correspond to what was/is. For instance, highest-lowest can utilize 5-30 connection, while I have set a-e to max at 50% in both outbound and inbound, so those classes, for all intents, are still "on the old connection."

    Of course I have set all the maxes and limits appropriately, this is just my basic philosophy.
  10. xtacydima

    xtacydima LI Guru Member

    I think you cleared up my confusion there. I was under the misconception, that by not having WWW set to highest, my performance on web surfing would slow down, however, I see this is not the case.

    I am thinking to use your set example and add games & torrents as follows:
    DNS - highest
    IP Cam - high
    WWW - medium
    FTP - low
    Games - A
    Torrents - B

    Should I leave all default Outbound rates or change any values?
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